{"id":62004,"date":"2021-11-30T12:51:46","date_gmt":"2021-11-30T11:51:46","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/www.apartamentomagazine.com\/?p=62004"},"modified":"2025-09-18T16:26:26","modified_gmt":"2025-09-18T14:26:26","slug":"serban-ionescu","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/www.apartamentomagazine.com\/stories\/serban-ionescu\/","title":{"rendered":"Serban Ionescu"},"content":{"rendered":" \t\t<div class=\"woocommerce\">\n\t\t\t<div class=\"woocommerce-info wc-memberships-restriction-message wc-memberships-message wc-memberships-content-restricted-message\">\n\t\t\t\tTo access this post, you must purchase <span class=\"wc-memberships-products-grant-access\"><a href=\"https:\/\/www.apartamentomagazine.com\/product\/apartamento-membership\/\">Apartamento Membership<\/a><\/span>.\t\t    <\/div>\n\t\t<\/div>\n\t\t","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"\n<div class=\"woocommerce\">\n<div class=\"woocommerce-info wc-memberships-restriction-message wc-memberships-message wc-memberships-content-restricted-message\">\n\t\t\t\tTo access this post, you must purchase <span class=\"wc-memberships-products-grant-access\"><a href=\"https:\/\/www.apartamentomagazine.com\/product\/apartamento-membership\/\">Apartamento Membership<\/a><\/span>.\t\t    <\/div>\n<\/p><\/div>\n","protected":false},"author":6,"featured_media":62036,"comment_status":"closed","ping_status":"open","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"_acf_changed":false,"footnotes":""},"categories":[106,30,47],"tags":[477,75],"class_list":["post-62004","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-fiction","category-interview","category-video","tag-books-writing","tag-art","authors-andrew-zebulon","authors-jeremy-liebman","authors-kristen-wentrcek","text_author-andrew-zebulon","text_author-kristen-wentrcek","photo_author-jeremy-liebman","film_author-berenice-eveno","membership-content","access-restricted"],"acf":{"link_archive":false,"archive_story":null,"archive_bg":"#F5F4EE","archive_title_color":"#000000","cover_bg":"#F5F4EE","cover_title_color":"#ffffff","body_bg":"#F5F4EE","body_text_color":"#000000","body_captions_color":"#666666","related_bg":"#ffffff","related_text_color":"#000000","stories_bg":"#EDECEC","alternative_image":62036,"hover_image":62031,"credits":"interview by Kristen Wentrcek & Andrew Zebulon\r\nphotography by Jeremy Liebman\r\nvideo directed by B\u00e9r\u00e9nice Eveno\r\n","title_format":"center","font_size":"medium","image_format":"cover","hero_image_mobile":"","video":"https:\/\/vz-a6a6cda4-492.b-cdn.net\/dc592f9c-e0f5-40c2-ab29-bd18150b96a8\/play_720p.mp4","video_excerpt":"https:\/\/player.vimeo.com\/external\/636113278.hd.mp4?s=3cee327b21fec505ffc37e5ba28b08b1b452077d&profile_id=175","video_format":"regular","content":[{"acf_fc_layout":"two_blocks","block_sizes":"half_40_60","content_type_left":"credits","image_size_left":"regular","image_left":null,"video_left_url":"","video_caption_left":"","video_left_type":false,"text_left":"","credit_image":62047,"credit_link_left":{"title":"Get your copy!","url":"https:\/\/www.apartamentomagazine.com\/product\/a-thing-on-a-table-in-a-house\/","target":""},"content_type_right":"text","image_size_right":"regular","image_right":null,"video_right_url":"","video_caption_right":"","video_right_type":false,"text_right":"<p class=\"p1\"><span class=\"s1\">The work of designer\/artist Serban Ionescu conjures a weird fusion of funny and creepy. Serban\u2019s pieces are nominally furniture, but they seem crouched, animated, full of some strange life. He often names them like you might name a pet, and they\u2019re imbued with a coiled, kinetic charge. The chairs are his trademark: they leer at you with sloppy faces; they\u2019re painted up in funhouse colours; they lean like drunks. A New Yorker by way of Romania, his work straddles multiple worlds: furniture design, architecture, metal work, and folk art.<\/span><\/p>\r\n<p class=\"p1\"><span class=\"s1\">We recently came to know Serban in that New York sort of way, where you see someone around at openings often enough that it starts to feel inevitable that you\u2019ll meet. Barrel-chested, often wearing a soft-shouldered jacket topped by a wide-brimmed hat, Serban cuts a distinctive figure. Eventually we did meet, arranging a drinking session via Instagram DM (how else). Anyone who has met Serban will tell you that he\u2019s a voracious conversationalist, eager to hold forth on any number of subjects. In that first meeting, holed up in a Greenpoint bar, we quickly got to trading stories about our respective practices, how we came to be in New York, and how we might work together in the future.<\/span><\/p>\r\n<p class=\"p1\"><span class=\"s1\">Serban lives with his partner and newborn baby in a cosy third-floor walk-up apartment in Brooklyn\u2019s Red Hook neighbourhood, not far from his studio. He designed and fabricated much of the interior himself, and it shows. Like one of his frenetic pieces writ large, the apartment is clean, open, organised, but at the same time stuffed with details. Art, drawings, books, and furniture are all arrayed and densely layered. As a summer storm rolled up and broke open over Red Hook, we sat down with Serban (on some of the first chairs he ever built) to talk about his process, art versus design, and watching his grandmother cast spells on the neighbours when he was a kid.<\/span><\/p>"},{"acf_fc_layout":"image","image_size":"regular","gallery":[62037,62036]},{"acf_fc_layout":"interview","interview":[{"question":"<p class=\"p1\"><span class=\"s1\">Kristen: Can we talk about your apartment a little bit<\/span>?<\/p>","answer":"<p class=\"p1\">Yeah. This apartment was abandoned, so nothing was here. The ceiling beams were exposed. The floor was all fucked up. There was no plumbing, no electrical. We punched that window in because you can see the Statue of Liberty and the water. When I was in the process of making furniture for it, I made a chair. I was making these sculptures that weren\u2019t functional.<\/p>\r\n<p class=\"p1\">My background is in architecture, and I kind of left the design\/architecture world in 2009. But, again, while I was in my studio, the work was very abstract. It wasn\u2019t about client design. I\u00a0was just painting and drawing and I\u00a0wanted to strip away what I had learned in school and was like, \u2018Hey, where can I go?\u2019 Let me go towards the cartoons.<\/p>"},{"question":"<p class=\"p1\"><span class=\"s1\">Andrew: You thought, \u2018I know what I learned in school, how can I throw it all away<\/span>?\u2019<\/p>","answer":"<p class=\"p1\">Exactly.<\/p>"},{"question":"<p class=\"p1\"><span class=\"s1\">Kristen: You\u2019re from Romania and then moved to New York, right<\/span>?<\/p>","answer":"<p class=\"p1\">Yeah, I was born in Romania. I was there from zero to 10.<\/p>"},{"question":"<p class=\"p1\"><span class=\"s1\">Kristen: What do you remember about that<\/span>?<\/p>","answer":"<p class=\"p1\">My parents came to New York when I was eight and I lived with my grandparents. So there were two years that I was by myself, more or less, with my grandparents. My parents came to New York to settle in and make a home. That was a crazy time. My grandfather died, so my grandmother was busy taking care of the whole funeral and dealing with grief. I\u00a0was discovering new friends, having crushes, stealing, trying cigarettes, getting drunk for the first time, huffing paint.<\/p>"}]},{"acf_fc_layout":"image","image_size":"full","gallery":[62040]},{"acf_fc_layout":"interview","interview":[{"question":"<p class=\"p1\"><span class=\"s1\">Andrew: Were you in the city or the countryside in Romania<\/span>?<\/p>","answer":"<p class=\"p1\">The city.<\/p>"},{"question":"<p class=\"p1\"><span class=\"s1\">Kristen: Were you one of these kids who always knew you wanted to be an architect<\/span>? <span class=\"s1\">Or were you just huffing paint and being cool<\/span>?<\/p>","answer":"<p class=\"p1\">I don\u2019t think I was\u2014there was no cool factor. It was post-communism, so Romania was in the shadow of the \u201880s. It was tough economically; there were lines for bread and milk and all this shit. There were no imports coming in. During the Cold War they were exporting all the goods, so people were limited in their resources, and a black market began forming. There was entertainment, films, music, all these things were coming through the black market. Both of my parents were engineers and draftspersons. My mom drew bombs and my dad drew tractors. He was a mechanical engineer and my mom was a nuclear engineer. My mom worked in a hidden mountain, some shit like that. She couldn\u2019t tell us where it was.<\/p>"},{"question":"<p class=\"p1\"><span class=\"s1\">Andrew: You\u2019re talking about the political context and the bread lines, but are you bringing all that stuff in now as an adult or were you aware of it as a child<\/span>?<\/p>","answer":"<p class=\"p1\">You can\u2019t contextualise at that age, right? When I tell people that my grandmother would beef with her neighbours and they would put spells on each other, when I\u2019m in that world, it\u2019s like, \u2018That\u2019s cool. Grandma\u2019s going to stop and put a lock of hair and spit on that woman\u2019s door\u2019. But now I think, \u2018Oh my god, my grandma just put a spell on our neighbour\u2019s house while we were going grocery shopping\u2019. It\u2019s kind of wild.<\/p>\r\n<p class=\"p1\">But I was around this engineering world, coming from both my parents and the way they drew things, and I would ask my dad, \u2018Hey, can you draw me a car?\u2019 He would always draw a plan view or an elevation view. So I\u00a0learned to draw that way. Parallel to that, my mother was\u2014again, because of this limitation on goods\u2014also a fashion designer. She would make her own clothes and I remember those drawings. They were elevational, fashion drawings.<\/p>"},{"question":"<p class=\"p1\"><span class=\"s1\">Andrew: Flats<\/span>.<\/p>","answer":"<p class=\"p1\">Yeah. I\u2019m an only child so drawing was\u2014I\u00a0didn\u2019t talk till I was six. I started drawing when I was three. Even now I draw daily and it\u2019s rejuvenating. My parents took me to doctors. They thought there was something wrong with me and there wasn\u2019t. It was maybe that I was too insecure to talk. When I came to the States, drawing was kind of a tool to interact with.<\/p>"}]},{"acf_fc_layout":"image","image_size":"regular","gallery":[62030,62035]},{"acf_fc_layout":"interview","interview":[{"question":"<p class=\"p1\"><span class=\"s1\">Kristen: It\u2019s interesting to me that you have an architecture background and also do interiors, but all of your furniture and sculpture work is so organic and stays in the 2D zone<\/span>. <span class=\"s1\">Why is that<\/span>?<\/p>","answer":"<p class=\"p1\">My furniture stuff? I don\u2019t see it as 2D at all.<\/p>"},{"question":"<p class=\"p1\"><span class=\"s1\">Kristen: Really<\/span>? <span class=\"s1\">It seems still drawn<\/span>.<\/p>\r\n<p class=\"p1\"><span class=\"s1\">Andrew: It seems like it comes from drawing or that it\u2019s rooted in that place<\/span>. <span class=\"s1\">When I look at it, it looks like a bunch of flat 2D drawings<\/span>. <span class=\"s1\">But then exploded<\/span>.<\/p>","answer":"<p class=\"p1\">Sure. Well, the edge is very important to me. It starts from the drawing and then I want for it to exist outside of material in some way. My work is very much about contrast. It\u2019s like a doodle, but I also spend days engineering it for it to come together in a certain way. It\u2019s a drawing that I might\u2019ve made in five seconds, but then it has to go through the meat grinder to become sorted out. In that flatness, I search for space. I\u2019ve always been interested in that feeling of flatness, and then once you digest it a little bit, you start understanding there\u2019s space there.<\/p>"},{"question":"<p class=\"p1\"><span class=\"s1\">Kristen: So, making a chair out of the drawing, is that a mechanism to create the space, or do you want it to be a chair specifically<\/span>?<\/p>","answer":"<p class=\"p1\">I think it\u2019s a combination of the scale that interested me at first. Chair-ness as just the function alone was something of interest. It was something similar to the olive in the Martini; it brings it all together. The functionality put it together somewhat. Before, because I was making sculpture, it had almost endless possibilities. I could have added or subtracted, but the functionality allowed me to zoom in, in some way.<\/p>"}]},{"acf_fc_layout":"image","image_size":"regular","gallery":[62029]},{"acf_fc_layout":"interview","interview":[{"question":"<p class=\"p1\"><span class=\"s1\">Andrew: Is the use important<\/span>?<\/p>","answer":"<p class=\"p1\">Somewhat. For the chair, I just like that scale. It was this scale that I worked in when I was making sculpture. It was something that I\u00a0could hold, something I could carry. It relates to the body in a certain way. So that\u2019s where the chair comes from, but I guess it was just the transformation. I needed to make chairs for this house and I probably wouldn\u2019t have made chairs, let\u2019s say, if this house didn\u2019t exist.<\/p>"},{"question":"<p class=\"p1\"><span class=\"s1\">Kristen: You talked about the edge being important<\/span>. <span class=\"s1\">Is metal the best substrate for you because you can get it really precise<\/span>?<\/p>","answer":"<p class=\"p1\">The notion of the edge is so important. It\u2019s right where a plane becomes a line, a line becomes a plane, or a plane becomes a volume. There\u2019s something so beautiful about turning the corner of something\u2014creating shadow, creating light. As I was going through the process of de-learning my architectural background, I would develop almost mechanical drawings. I was making them without thinking. And I really started loving the impulse of my line and was trying to transfer that to painting for many years. I was trying to bring that energy of Cy Twombly or Eddie Martinez. And then I started working with steel and it wasn\u2019t so much the sharpness, but more the lack of material that I could get out of it. Some of my pieces are very thin, an eighth of an inch. I can\u2019t find any other material that I can create space with that is so thin. Then I painted with powder coat to make it look plastic. I\u00a0don\u2019t care about the material. When people ask me what that steel or wood represent, I\u2019m not interested.<\/p>"},{"question":"<p class=\"p1\"><span class=\"s1\">Andrew: You were speaking to the immediacy of the drawing, and you said that sometimes the drawing only takes a few seconds and then you spend a lot of time with the engineering<\/span>. <span class=\"s1\">But I was wondering how much you think about that<\/span>. <span class=\"s1\">We grapple with this in our work, too<\/span>. <span class=\"s1\">Sometimes you do something really quickly and you\u2019re sort of mistrustful, saying, \u2018Was it too easy<\/span>?\u2019 <span class=\"s1\">Do you have those reservations<\/span>?<\/p>","answer":"<p class=\"p1\">As you get wiser and older, your instincts become sharper, right? I want to trust what I\u2019m making. I want to trust that I\u2019ve drawn for 30 some years and that I\u2019m confident in the line I\u2019m making. A lot of my work goes through the computer and I have many filters where I allow myself to change it if I want. A close friend of mine, Carlos Little, who is a great artist and sculptor, said, \u2018If you can do it twice, it\u2019s not worth it\u2019.<\/p>"},{"question":"<p class=\"p1\"><span class=\"s1\">Andrew: That\u2019s interesting too<\/span>. <span class=\"s1\">When you\u2019re making furniture, people will ask you, \u2018I love this chair, could I have four identical ones for my dining room<\/span>?\u2019 <span class=\"s1\">It gets at that whole \u2018where is the line between art versus design\u2019 thing<\/span>.<\/p>","answer":"<p class=\"p1\">I did the first chair three and a half years ago, and it was just me working with that scale and trying to make work that I could carry by myself. I think the chair was like the painting. It\u2019s a flat plane, almost infinite in itself. And all my painter friends, I\u2019m always mesmerised by the need to enter that void and enter that plane and work within that constraint. I\u00a0think the chair has that: 17, 18 inches above the ground, and a back or arm rest. It\u2019s like a three-dimensional painting.<\/p>"}]},{"acf_fc_layout":"image","image_size":"regular","gallery":[60722,60718,60712,60716]},{"acf_fc_layout":"interview","interview":[{"question":"<p class=\"p1\"><span class=\"s1\">Kristen: Were the wood pieces you made for a particular project<\/span>?<\/p>","answer":"<p class=\"p1\">I called them \u2018Folks\u2019. I was in Romania, probably in 2014, and I went to the Museum of the Peasant, which is pretty wild. I stumbled upon this room where there were maybe 12 dozen of these peasant chairs. Some of the backs had a face, though not a smiley face. That image really stuck with me. It looked like a crowded room. Then I did a show called \u2018The Crowded Room\u2019. It was about the passing of time as an immigrant; it was a little bit autobiographical. I was trying to talk about that with some of the pieces being characters and adapting within a space and so on. I was like, \u2018I need to have something that speaks to my past in some way\u2019. I made this chair one night in my studio, quick. I was also thinking about Gaetano Pesce. He\u2019s done those face chairs, like the child chairs, but he\u2019s really about technology and resins. Instead of going towards that path, I went in the opposite direction. And that contrast, something clicked there. As I was making them, they would break, because it\u2019s old wood. So then I used these little leftovers from my steel pieces as the mending plates. They became these mended, folky things and people loved them.<\/p>"},{"question":"<p class=\"p1\"><span class=\"s1\">Kristen: When we do more iterations of work, I\u00a0think what we typically change is the material, and the forms really stay the same<\/span>. <span class=\"s1\">For you, is there a concept that you know you\u2019ll always be integrating, like a touchstone<\/span>?<\/p>","answer":"<p class=\"p1\">I\u2019m interested in time, the autobiographical aspect to it. How the work fits in the spectrum of time. Let\u2019s say from now until I die. Or how the work is made, the time a quick drawing takes.<\/p>"},{"question":"<p class=\"p1\"><span class=\"s1\">Andrew: You make these quick, instinctual drawings and sort of capture that moment<\/span>.<span class=\"s1\"> You were talking about somebody like Twombly, who was trying to capture the energy of the gesture<\/span>. <span class=\"s1\">So maybe you\u2019re attempting to grab that and snapshot it<\/span>?<\/p>","answer":"<p class=\"p1\">Exactly, I think that\u2019s part of it. But at the end maybe the main thing is form. I\u2019m interested in creating new forms.<\/p>"},{"question":"<p class=\"p1\"><span class=\"s1\">Andrew: Thinking about the work of yours that I\u2019ve seen, colour is a big component<\/span>. <span class=\"s1\">How do you choose those colours<\/span>?<\/p>","answer":"<p class=\"p1\">Sometimes it\u2019s just like, \u2018Oh, I need to make this thing red\u2019. Then I look through my studio and pick whatever I have. If don\u2019t have the red that\u2019s in my head, I paint it orange. That first instinct will never be satisfied, though. I\u00a0always have to go to the hardware store to get the proper colour.<\/p>"},{"question":"<p class=\"p1\"><span class=\"s1\">Andrew: Do you ever choose the colour you think you want, only to find out you were wrong and now it\u2019s too late<\/span>? <span class=\"s1\">Because powder coating is like, you do it and then it\u2019s done<\/span>.<\/p>","answer":"<p class=\"p1\">Exactly. For every process that I have, I want an element of surprise and excitement. It\u2019s kind of like having Christmas five times during the making of an object. You bring this hunk of steel to the powder coaters and then get back this glossy, shiny object.<\/p>"}]},{"acf_fc_layout":"image","image_size":"full","gallery":[62031]},{"acf_fc_layout":"interview","interview":[{"question":"<p class=\"p1\"><span class=\"s1\">Andrew: Thinking again about this question of, \u2018Why make a chair<\/span>?\u2019 <span class=\"s1\">Maybe part of the answer for you is, any piece of furniture is a small-scale impact on a space<\/span>. <span class=\"s1\">Furniture is very practically part of the environment<\/span>.<\/p>","answer":"<p class=\"p1\">I had this thing when I was teaching: the cat in architecture. It\u2019s the concept of an empty room versus a room with a cat in it. What is that cat? What is that disturbance to a space? Let\u2019s say space is a positive rather than negative. Then the cat is a negative to that positive space. So what is that negative space that gets formed by a cat moving in a room? What is it about bringing something into a room that\u2019s maybe not controllable, maybe not part of it? And what is the responsibility? How do you interact? That goes back to the idea of misuse as well. I\u2019ve had pieces during a show where people put a coat on it and you\u2019re like, \u2018Whoa, this is an exhibition\u2019. It\u2019s the worst.<\/p>"},{"question":"<p class=\"p1\"><span class=\"s1\">Kristen: Do you think there is anything negative about participating in design shows ultimately<\/span>?<\/p>\r\n<p class=\"p1\"><span class=\"s1\">Andrew: This is the hardest thing<\/span>. <span class=\"s1\">You could sell someone a painting and they could paint over it, but presumably they wouldn\u2019t<\/span>. <span class=\"s1\">Whereas you build someone a house, and they feel well within their rights to paint the house<\/span>.<\/p>\r\n<p class=\"p1\"><span class=\"s1\">Kristen: Or if you\u2019re participating in a design-specific show, I wonder about how that goes into your canon, and how that context may cement your work in some people\u2019s minds<\/span>. <span class=\"s1\">This is something Andrew and I talk about a lot, and I don\u2019t know if there is really an answer<\/span>.<\/p>\r\n<p class=\"p1\"><span class=\"s1\">Andrew: It\u2019s the chair-guy problem<\/span>.<\/p>","answer":"<p class=\"p1\">Yeah, of course. But I would always surprise. I\u00a0will maybe at times sabotage, because of that surprise. I always get feedback from people that own my work; someone who has lived with my work says, \u2018Oh, it grew on me\u2019. Especially in today\u2019s time, where images are digested within fractions of seconds, it\u2019s nice to hear that. My work has this element of digestion.<\/p>"},{"question":"<p class=\"p1\"><span class=\"s1\">Andrew: We\u2019ve talked a lot about this in terms of our work: starting with something that was wholly about design and drifting further away from that and then feeling like what we\u2019re really doing now is more sculptural<\/span>. <span class=\"s1\">You go back and forth between saying, \u2018I don\u2019t care, and people will feel how they feel\u2019, and then needing to do some framing to help people perceive your intent<\/span>.<\/p>","answer":"<p class=\"p1\">Historically we\u2019ve always had to compartmentalise ourselves in language and in order. I\u00a0feel like the dialogue between art and design kind of lies between that. Sometimes when I go to bed I\u2019m like, \u2018I\u2019m a fucking artist. I mean, fuck, fuck, fuck that client\u2019.<\/p>"},{"question":"<p class=\"p1\"><span class=\"s1\">Kristen: It\u2019s like, \u2018How dare you, trying to tell me what to do<\/span>\u2019.<\/p>\r\n<p class=\"p1\"><span class=\"s1\">Andrew: Yes, except all of the clients we\u2019ve ever had, they\u2019re great<\/span>!<\/p>","answer":"<p class=\"p1\">But it\u2019s interesting how the dialogue with the client has changed, because of technology, Pinterest, and all these other things. I think a lot of clients think they could also design. I\u00a0think for any designer or anything like that, it\u2019s about creating a very bold aesthetic, where people come to me to get that.<\/p>"},{"question":"<p class=\"p1\"><span class=\"s1\">Andrew: Maybe that, to some degree, accounts for the rise of the artist-designer thing<\/span>. <span class=\"s1\">Because artists are considered to be these conduits for inspiration, and what they produce is unaltered<\/span>. <span class=\"s1\">Designers are craftspeople that work with the client to make a thing<\/span>. <span class=\"s1\">But if you are like an artist as a designer, then it becomes, \u2018I\u2019m going to design something, and you can\u2019t alter it<\/span>\u2019.<\/p>\r\n<p class=\"p1\"><span class=\"s1\">Kristen: Blurring those two is pretty dangerous on some level<\/span>. <span class=\"s1\">You\u2019re really perverting both of those things by conflating them<\/span>.<\/p>","answer":"<p class=\"p1\">But at the end of the day, I feel like it\u2019s about survival for the self. I\u2019m thinking about making oil paintings. I\u2019d love to make them in a year or so, and just make very large sculptures and small oil paintings. I don\u2019t want to be the guy that was afraid to use yellow, or if I want to design a house, I\u2019ll make a house, if I want to design a chair\u2014<\/p>"},{"question":"<p class=\"p1\"><span class=\"s1\">Andrew: You sort of say, \u2018I will do whatever I\u00a0want\u2019, and then just be a person that\u2019s living in the real world<\/span>. <span class=\"s1\">And you determine the ways in which you navigate things and find the places where you do the things that you want to do<\/span>.<\/p>","answer":"<p class=\"p1\">Absolutely. Then there\u2019s a public that might see you as an artist and others that see you as a designer. To be honest, coming from architecture and having left it in some kind of conscious way, and coming back to it through this other refreshed mindset, I\u2019m perceiving it differently. So maybe the audience needs to perceive that. And it\u2019s our responsibility, and I\u00a0hate this. I\u2019m not the most responsible person.<\/p>"},{"question":"<p class=\"p1\"><span class=\"s1\">Kristen: Yeah<\/span>. <span class=\"s1\">It\u2019s like none of it matters, all of it matters<\/span>. <span class=\"s1\">I don\u2019t know<\/span>.<\/p>","answer":"<p class=\"p1\">Exactly. It\u2019s terrible, but I think it\u2019s about obviously attempting to do good work, number one. Number two: someone likes it, validates it.<\/p>"},{"question":"<p class=\"p1\"><span class=\"s1\">Kristen: Number two: hashtag it<\/span>.<\/p>","answer":"<p class=\"p1\">Yeah, that\u2019s number three. This is why I\u2019ve never had that dialogue. As long as I\u2019m in the studio and I feel like I\u2019m awake and feeling good and there\u2019s something that\u2019s moving through me, if someone could sit on this piece and someone could fuck on it or someone could just look at it, I\u2019m satisfied. No matter what that work indicates. If there\u2019s something emotional that I might\u2019ve been able to dictate and put into that, and that thing resonates and vibrates, then I\u2019m satisfied.<\/p>"}]},{"acf_fc_layout":"image","image_size":"regular","gallery":[62034]}],"related_text":"This book is in itself a Serban Ionescu sculpture, its 68-page oversized board book format having been printed and precisely die-cut to mimic the rambling contours and dazzling colours found on the steel sculptures of this prolific New York-based, Romanian-born artist. 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